210: Sex Work and Infidelity Part 2

Hi everyone, I’m Dr. Marie Murphy, and I’m a non-judgmental infidelity coach.  If you are engaging in anything you think counts as infidelity, I can help you deal with your feelings, clarify what you want, and make decisions about what you’re going to do.  No shame, no blame, no judgments.  A lot of the so-called advice out there for people who are cheating is little more than thinly veiled judgment, but that is not what I provide.  I give you guidance and support that respects the fullness of your humanity, and the complexity of your situation, no matter what you’re doing.  When you are ready to resolve your infidelity situation in a way that’s truly right for you, there are two ways we can work together.  You can enroll in my online course, You’re Not the Only One, which contains powerful teachings and assignments that go beyond what I offer on the podcast.  Or we can work together one-on-one via Zoom.  To get started with either of these options, go to my website, mariemurphyphd.com.  Together we will find you some relief and a clear path forward.

Okay folks, today we are going to talk more about infidelity and sex work.  If you missed the first episode I did on infidelity and sex work a little while back, you might want to listen to it before you listen to this one, because I make some general points about sex work and the relationship between sex work and infidelity that apply to what I’m going to talk about today.  

Just like I did in that other episode, I want to emphasize that sex work is a big topic, and the intersections between infidelity and sex work are also a big topic, and we’re just going to look at another little slice of the pie today.  And just like I did last time, I’m going to suggest a little reading that might be of interest.  Two memoirs that focus a lot on sex work that are well worth a read are An Honest Woman by Charlotte Shane, and Whip Smart: The True Story of a Secret Life by Melissa Febos.  

Since there are so many misconceptions about and prejudices against sex work out there, I feel compelled to note that neither of these women’s stories are the final word on anything.  But both books tell stories that are interesting, well-written, and full of food for thought.  On a lot of things related to relationships – not just sex work.  

So the specific thing we’re going to focus on today is this: some people tell me that they feel like a current partner has cheated on them by paying for sex or being paid for sex in the past.  And just to be really clear, I mean that someone discovers that their current partner, or perhaps, a current potential partner paid for sex or sold sex before they ever met this person – and this person thinks that their new partner’s past actions retroactively count as cheating.

And on a closely related note, some folks worry that they are cheating on a future partner if they’re paying for sex in the present, or selling sex in the present.  And this is an unspecified future partner!  The future partner, whoever they are, doesn’t exist in their life yet.  But the person who is worrying is afraid that their current participation in exchanging sex for money constitutes cheating on this future partner who they have yet to meet.

Maybe you can totally relate to this kind of concern.

Or maybe this kind of concern sounds kind of odd, or completely crazy to you.

If the idea that something you’ve done in the past could constitute cheating in the present, or in the future, sounds perplexing, let me say this: people have all kinds of different ideas about infidelity, and what counts as infidelity, or could count as infidelity.  And, people have all kinds of ideas about what we owe our partners, or what might owe a future partner.  Humans are different!  

Sometimes it’s useful to simply behold the diversity of human experiences, and the diversity of ways in which people think about particular things.  And, as I will explain as we move through this topic, what we’re discussing today has bearing upon how we want to navigate discussions about our sexual and romantic history when we’re getting involved with someone new, and how we want to regard a prospective partner’s past.  This maybe relevant to you even if you’ve never paid for sex or sold sex.

So here’s what sometimes happens: two people will meet, and they’ll become interested in each other, and they’ll start getting to know each other better, and they’ll start sharing information about their life experiences with each other.  And then at some point, they’ll start talking about their sexual history, or their past experiences with relationships, or some combination thereof.  And sometimes, one member of this new potential couple shares something that totally freaks the other person out.  Or maybe both parties share aspects of their history that totally freaks the other person out.

And today I’m focused on the example of having exchanged sex for money in the past, but the historical details that occasion discomfort or maybe even alarm could have nothing to do with sex work.  For instance, maybe someone tells their new partner that they’ve been engaged five times, and they ditched their soon-to-be spouse at the altar each of those five times.  Maybe you hear that from someone you’re on a very exciting second date with, and you see that as a huge red flag.  Or maybe someone tells their new prospective partner that they’ve never had sex, or never had a romantic relationship of any kind, and that seems alarming to the person receiving this information.  Or maybe someone shares that they’ve had sex with five hundred and ten humans, twelve robots, and a few live animals here and there, and that sends the new person they’ve met into a state of confusion and insecurity.

And then all of a sudden, these two people who were having a pretty great time getting to know one another are faced with the question of, what does this person’s past mean for our current relationship?  They may not be thinking about it that way, though: one – or both – members of the new couple may be thinking, “I don’t know if I want to be with a person who has done THAT in their past,” or maybe “That person shouldn’t have done the things they did in the past, because that’s bad for our relationship now” or perhaps, “That person effectively cheated on me, even if they did whatever they did before we ever met.”

And the other member of the couple – or maybe both members of the couple – may be thinking, “Why the hell is this wonderful new person I’ve met judging me for my past actions?  How could anything I did in the past POSSIBLY constitute cheating on anyone in the future?”

And these situations can be excruciatingly painful!  If you find yourself in a situation like this, this may feel like a really unfortunate, really painful disconnect between your understanding of the past and its relationship to the present, and your prospective partner’s understanding of the past and its relevance to the present.

So what are we to do if we find ourselves in a situation like this?  I’m going to speak to what we may be able to do if we’ve already found ourselves in this kind of a situation, meaning, if we or a new person we’re dating has shared a detail of our sexual history that the other person has gotten freaked out about.  And then I’m going to talk about how we might be able to manage these kinds of situations before they happen, or perhaps even prevent these kinds of situations from happening at all.

If you have just started getting to know someone, and you really like them, and you’re excited to see where things could go with them, and then they share that they’ve sold sex or paid for sex, and you are totally freaked out by that, here’s what I suggest.

First of all, it’s important to recognize how stigmatized sex work is, and it’s important to recognize that you may have absorbed the idea that anyone who participates in sex work as a provider or consumer is doing something bad, or is fundamentally a bad person.  Or a tainted person.  Or a dirty person.  If this is what you currently think, there’s a good chance you’ve picked up these beliefs without really examining them or questioning them.

But you have the opportunity to question them now, if you want to.  If you LIKE the way you think about sex work and anyone who has participated in it, you get to keep your current way of thinking.  Nobody can take that away from you, so if you like it, it’s yours.  And if you want to break off a new connection because the person you’ve met has bought or sold sex in the past, that’s your prerogative.  

If you decide you’re going to do that, I strongly recommend that you take responsibility for your preferences, however.  What some people do is decide that they’re totally justified in thinking that someone who has bought or sold sex in the past is a bad, dirty person and when they break up with their new person because of their history with sex work, they blame their new person for having engaged in sex work in the first place.  

They say things like, “Well, you should have known better.  You should have known that someone you were going to meet in the future wouldn’t have liked it that you sold sex.”  Or paid for sex, or whatever.  “So therefore, it’s really your fault that I’m breaking up with you.  You did the bad thing.”

Here's what I have to say about that.  You have the right to be uncomfortable with sex work.  And it’s your prerogative to choose to not pursue a relationship with someone who has sold sex or paid for sex because you’re not cool with that, even if it happened in the distant past.  But is it your place to decide that sex work is fundamentally bad, and to tell others they’re bad for exchanging sex for money?  I want to suggest that it isn’t.  So, if you learn that someone you’ve been dating exchanged sex for money in the past, and you are not happy to hear that, I encourage you to try to take a moment to collect yourself before you say anything.  

Then, if you decide that you do want to end the nascent relationship, take responsibility for your preferences.  You might say something like, “Listen, I’ve really enjoyed getting to know you, but I’m really uncomfortable with this detail of your history, and I’m not sure I’m going to be able to get over that.  And since I don’t know if I can stay in our relationship without poisoning it with my discomfort, I want to thank you for the time that we’ve shared, and move on.”  Or whatever.  I’m not suggesting you have to use those exact words, but that is one way to be honest and direct, and to take responsibility for your preferences instead of scolding someone else for their choices.

On the other hand, if you’ve met someone you really like, and they have some history of exchanging sex for money, and you’re uncomfortable with that, you might want to figure out how you can deal with your discomfort so that you can pursue a relationship with your new person with an open heart!  And that may entail many things, but at the very least, it will include examining your ideas about the relevance of someone’s relationship history to your current relationship with them, and examining your ideas about buying and selling sex.  Your current ideas on these matters may not be ideas you want to keep – if you want to continue an enjoyable relationship with the lovely person you’ve just met, anyway.  

Upon examining your thinking, you might decide that the past doesn’t have to matter in the present.  You might decide that how you and your new partner engage with each other now matters a lot more than whatever experiences they’ve had in the past.  You might decide that you don’t need to think about your new partner’s sexual history ever again.  You can choose to forget about their history with sex work, if you want to.  It really is possible to do that, but I’m not going to get into the details of how right now.

Upon further consideration, you also might come to decide that exchanging sex for money isn’t quite as big of a deal as you once thought it was.  Examining and possibly shifting your thinking any topic is usually a process.  Even when we know we WANT to change our thinking on a particular topic, it can take a lot of effort to do this, even when we’re very motivated to do so, because if we’ve been thinking a particular thought or set of thoughts for a long time, our brain is in the habit of treating those thoughts as THE TRUTH.  But thank goodness for neuroplasticity.  

Changing our habitual ways of seeing the world IS possible.  And sometimes it’s totally appropriate and totally worth it to invest time and energy into intentionally changing our beliefs.  If you really like someone, you may not WANT to be bothered by experiences they’ve had in their past.  It might be totally worth it to you to shift your thinking about the relevance of the past to the present in general, and the significance you assign to any experiences they’ve had in their past.

And it might be worth it because you’ve met someone great, and you really want to focus on the present with them, and creating an amazing future with them.  The way we experience the past is by thinking about it in the present.  So you might want to make some very conscious choices about how you think about the past, for the sake of deliberately creating your experience of the present and the future.

Now all of this foreshadows a situation that you could run into, but might not have yet.  Let’s say you’re meeting new people in a dating kind of way.  Or let’s say you think you might be on the brink of being in that kind of a situation.  You have the opportunity to proactively think about what you might want to know about a prospective partner’s sexual history or relationship history, and what you might want to share about your own.  You also have the opportunity to consider what you DON’T want to know about someone else’s history, and what you don’t want to share about your own.  

No matter how old you are, I encourage you to consider that you have a past of some sort, and that people you meet are going to have a past of some sort.  That may sound rather obvious, but what I often hear people telling me is, “Well, I met this new person, and they seemed really great, but then I learned that they had done this sexual thing and that sexual thing, and I was totally shocked by that, and that really put me off.”  

And what this so poignantly draws our attention to is the fact that sometimes we have operating assumptions about what another person’s past should look like or not look like!  Moreover, sometimes it has never occurred to us that someone might have had sexual experiences with other people at all before meeting us, and we’re a little stunned when this is made apparent.

So it can be really useful to acknowledge that it is possible, and perhaps even likely, that new people you meet have had sex with other people before meeting you.  It can be really useful to recognize that new people you meet have possibly fallen in and out of love before meeting you.  It can be really useful to consider that it’s possible that people you meet have will done sexual things that you’re a little freaked out by before meeting you.  It’s possible that people you meet will have romantic histories that wouldn’t make it onto the Hallmark channel.  If that even still exists!  I don’t know if it does or not, and I’m not bothering to look it up, but I know some of you know what I’m talking about.  

Or maybe it’s an ABSENCE of sexual experience on someone else’s part that gets your alarm bells ringing.  While some fifty-something year olds are freaked out when they meet a new partner who’s had dozens of sexual partners, some are freaked out when they meet someone who has had one or two sexual partners.  And I use fifty-something year olds just as an example – I hear this kind of thing from folks of all different ages, but it’s reasonable to note that the older you get, the more life you have under your belt.  And unless you are planning to date people who are just starting out in their sexual lives or romantic lives, they’re going to have some history under their belt, too.

So if we take it as a given that people you meet are going to have some kind of past, it can be really useful to consider what you might want to know about their past, and what might NOT want to know about their past.  It may be really useful to think about what you want to share about your own sexual and romantic history, and what you don’t want to share.  It can be really useful to think about this kind of stuff ahead of time, before you find yourself on a date with someone new and fabulous, if you have the opportunity to plan ahead in this manner.

How do you know what you want to know or not know about someone’s past?  Well, you decide.  There are many viable starting places for deciding, and one is, your past experiences.

Maybe you had a relationship with someone at some point in the past who talked about their ex’s all the time.  Did you like that?  Maybe you loved it!  Maybe you ate up every detail about your ex’s sexual experiences with their exes.  Maybe you LOVED hearing the stories of how they met, fell in love with, and then eventually ended things with their past lovers.  Or maybe you HATED it.  Maybe you only wanted to get a rough sketch of your ex’s relationship history and sexual history – and instead you got way more information than you wanted, and when you asked them to stop oversharing, they wouldn’t, and you didn’t like that either.  

Or maybe you were involved with someone who wouldn’t tell you ANYTHING about their relationship history or sexual history.  Maybe you loved that!  Maybe not hearing about their past experiences helped you focus on the what the two of you were experiencing together in the present.  Or maybe you tend towards being jealous of your partner’s exes, and since your partner didn’t tell you anything about their exes, you didn’t find any reason to be jealous, and maybe that worked out great for you.  

Those kinds of experiences may inform your current preferences.  Can your preferences change over time?  Sure they can.  But if you don’t know what your current preferences are, you can look around for clues, and your past experiences COULD be a useful reference point.  The past doesn’t have to matter, but if it’s helpful, use it to your advantage!  

If you don’t have any past experiences to draw upon, no problem.  Imagine going on a date with someone you really like.  What might you IMAGINE wanting to know about this person’s relationship history or sexual history, and why?  What might you imagine NOT wanting to know, and why?  

It’s important to recognize that whatever you decide about what you want to share or not share or learn or not learn can be adjusted.  You’re not coming up with a set of parameters for the sake of committing to them for the rest of your life or anything like that.  But having SOME sense of what you might want to know or not know can help you intentionally create the kind of relationship you want to have, or create the kinds of dating experiences you want to have.

Now, once you’ve decided – however tentatively – what you want to know or not know about a prospective partner’s history, you get to decide how you want to tell them this.  Let’s say you’ve decided you don’t want to know many details of a new person’s sexual history.  You really don’t want to know much of anything at all.  That’s a fair preference to have.  

Now how could you communicate this to someone?  Well, you could say something like, “Hi, it’s nice to meet you, please don’t tell me anything about your sexual history because I’m totally freaked out by the idea that you have any kind of a sexual history at all, and I will lose my shit and hate you if I learn any details.”  But I don’t really recommend that!

Instead, you might want to say something like, “Hey, I’m really enjoying getting to know you, and I’m hoping that we might get to know each other better in a lot of different ways.  But I just want you to know that when it comes to anything related to sex, I’m a lot more interested in creating a sexual connection with you than I am in hearing about the sexual experiences you’ve had in the past.  Let’s focus on each other, and getting to know each other in the present in this way.  Let’s leave our respective pasts in the past.”  When you phrase it that way, you’re stating your preferences, and you’re also focusing on what you hope to create with the new person you’ve met – namely, a connection with each other in the present.

Similarly, you get to decide what you share and don’t share about your history.

You might decide that the past is past and your past is your business and that’s that.  You might decide there are some things you’re willing to talk about, if a new partner is interested.  You might decide there are some things you really want a new person to know about your sexual and romantic history, even if they aren’t seeking those details out from you.  

Just as I encourage you to think deliberately about what you want to know or not know about another person’s past, and why, I also encourage you to think deliberately about what you want to share about your own history, and why.

Some people share things because they think that sharing their sexual and romantic history creates intimacy with a new partner.

Some people think that sharing about these aspects of their past is a NECESSARY part of forging a relationship with a new person.  Some people think that there’s a requisite amount of this kind of information that they need to share in order for a new partner to fully understand them.

Some people share their sexual and romantic history as a form of bragging, or showing off.

Some people share about their past because they want forgiveness, or approval, or absolution.  Sometimes people think that their past makes them tainted, so they’d better share the details that supposedly taint them so the new person they’re dating can decide if they’re willing to stick around or not.

Some people share the details of their sexual and romantic history because they’re still trying to make sense of them, and they want someone to talk to about these aspects of their life – and they may find that their new partner just so happens to be happy to listen.

And of course, sometimes people share the details of their sexual and romantic history without having any clear reasons for doing so.  They just do it, and they don’t really know why.

I want to suggest that you have the right to want to share or not share as much as you want to, AND I want to encourage you to get clear on your reasons for sharing or not sharing.  Think about what your goals are in your new relationship, or any potential new relationship, and think about how sharing or not sharing the details of your past will help you achieve these goals.  For example, what a lot of people essentially want is to create a great connection with a new person, or new people, plural.  If that’s what you’re after, think about how what you share or keep private serves your purposes.

Now all of that said, deciding what you want to share of your own sexual history or learn about another person’s is one thing, and working this out with another person who may see things very differently from the way you see them is another.

You may decide that you don’t want to share much about your own sexual history with a new prospective partner, and you don’t want to know much about your prospective partner’s sexual history, either.  Knowing that is great, but you could still find yourself on a date with someone who is hell-bent on learning all kinds of details about your sexual past.  Or sharing all of the details of theirs.  And this might create some discord. 

Unless you have some pretty intense screening processes in place, it might be difficult to prevent this from ever happening.  But when you know what your preferences about sharing sexual histories look like, it’s a lot easier to proactively discuss sharing protocols in a classy way, and it becomes easier to identify and deal with different preferences, or incompatibilities.  If you meet someone who wants to know EVERY detail of your sexual history and you haven’t given any thought as to what you truly want to share, dealing with this person’s desire to know is going to be different than it will be if you have a pretty solid sense of what you want to share and what you don’t. 

With everything I’ve said to this point in mind, I want to return to the question of whether anything you’ve done in the past – including exchanging sex for money – counts as cheating in the present.

My opinion is that anything you’ve done in the past does not count as cheating in the present.  My opinion is that you have the right to keep your past as private as you want to.  I do also believe that if something from your past has bearing upon the present, it might be a very good idea to share that with a new partner, but you get to exercise your judgement about what counts as something from the past having bearing upon the present.  How do we know if something from the past has bearing upon the present?  We decide.  And you get to make that choice for yourself.

Also, to echo something I said more about in the first episode on infidelity and sex work which came out pretty recently, I don’t believe that it’s inherently problematic to exchange sex for money.  And by extension, I don’t believe that if you’ve exchanged sex for money in the past, you’ve done some terrible thing that has to be shared with a new partner or else you’re hiding something from them that you have no right to hide.

But although this is what I think about sex work and about the relevance of the past to the present, you’re allowed to have different ideas.  Obviously!  What I think is super important is that you get really clear on what your ideas are, and decide whether they’re serving you or not.  And if they are, great.  

But it usually works out better when we recognize that our preferences are our preferences, rather than absolute standards for how things should be, and we take ownership of them, rather than assuming everyone should see things the same way we do.  Assuming that everyone regards the relevance of the past to the present in the same way you do may lead to some funny stuff in your relationships.  Assuming that everyone sees sex work the same way you do may also lead to some funny stuff in your relationships.  So clarify your perspectives and take responsibility for them.

All right.  If you want my help figuring out where you stand in relation to disclosing that you’ve exchanged sex for money in the past, or how to deal with learning about someone else having exchanged sex for money in the past, let’s talk.  You have a sense of what my perspectives are, but my goal as your coach is not to get you to think like I do.  Rather, my agenda is to help you clarify what you think, and arrive at an intentional set of beliefs that serve you well.  

So if you want my help with anything I’ve talked about today, or anything else related to your infidelity situation, head on over to my website and schedule an introductory coaching session with me.  And of course, you can also learn more from me by enrolling in my online course, You’re Not the Only One, which contains teachings and assignments that go beyond what I offer on the podcast.  Mariemurphyphd.com.

Thank you all so much for listening!  Have a great day.  Bye for now.